June's transcript

June: [00:00:00] My name is [June] I've lived in the Village of Champlain for almost exactly 33 years. I am a retired French teacher from the local high school, Northeastern Clinton Central School. I raised my family here, three children, and was just elected mayor of the village, and I'm co-owner of the Champlain Meeting House, which is our local community centre.

RRTeam:[00:00:23] Wow. Okay. Thank you.

June: [00:00:25] You're welcome.

RRTeam:[00:00:26] Could you tell us about how you started the work with Plattsburgh Cares?

June: [00:00:32] I don't want to make it a long, involved, convoluted story. When we first started reading in the Canadian newspapers about asylum seekers passing through Plattsburgh on their way to Roxham road, the mayor of Plattsburgh, Colin Reed, thought there was a possibility that they might get stuck in the city of Plattsburgh. He called about three people together who he thought might be interested and [00:01:00] have some background to form a group which became known as Plattsburgh Cares. And, even though I don't live in Plattsburgh, I was one of those people because, first, Colin knows me, and secondly, he knows that I'm active up here on the border. So, that's how Plattsburgh Cares got started.

RRTeam:[00:01:17] Yeah, so Colin Reed knew that you were somebody who was involved with things at the border. Is that how you say it?

June: [00:01:23] Well, on a border town.

RRTeam:[00:01:24] So what does that involve and what does that mean to you? What do you think he meant by that?

June: [00:01:29] I don't think he particularly thought that I was involved in any kind of refugee or asylum seeker…

RRTeam:[00:01:34] Right. Yeah.

June: [00:01:36] ... stuff. But, he knew, and he knows that I'm one of the go to active people in this community. I organize a lot of presentations and talks and events here, and he had given a presentation, actually, in Champlain, I think the year before, and we just know each other through local government since he's the mayor of [00:02:00] Plattsburgh.

RRTeam:[00:02:01] And, when the newspaper started to report all these things so what was that first meeting like?

June: [00:02:08] That first meeting, actually, we didn't know a lot. All we knew was what we had read from Canadian newspapers, and I had heard nothing from American newspapers at that time. There probably were some stories, but nothing local for sure. We only had the information from the Canadian newspapers that we had seen on social media, and we were just struggling to understand what was even going on. What were the numbers like? What were the taxi drivers doing? Were they price gouging? We had a lot of fears. Were people going to end up on the street not knowing where to go? Did they need housing? Did they need food? Did they need healthcare? Did they need legal care? It was a lot of question marks.

RRTeam:[00:02:51] Yeah. And how did you plan about going to figure out those answers to those questions?

June: [00:02:59] Yeah, it [00:03:00] took us a long time and a lot of meetings to figure out how we could answer those concerns if they came up, because in fact, we weren't even sure it was going to happen. And indeed, it has gone a little bit differently than we anticipated two years ago. But we started with getting some legal help. We have a lawyer in Plattsburgh Cares, a retired lawyer in Plattsburgh Cares who was very helpful. We connected with Department of Social Services to talk about housing. We connected with JCEO to talk about food. So we went to existing agencies to find out how we could network with them to offer services if anyone arrived. And that's basically the groundwork that we laid.

RRTeam:[00:03:46] Wow. You started all of that already before people started arriving.

June: [00:03:50] Well, they were arriving in small numbers. So, if you look at a timeline, the first stories that I read about were February [00:04:00] of 2016, and that was probably about a week or two after the inauguration of President Trump.

RRTeam:[00:04:09] Right. Do you mean 2017?

June: [00:04:11] Yeah. That's right. He was elected in '16 and inaugurated in '17. So, February of 2017 was when we first started seeing images and reading some stories about people crossing through the ditch on Roxham road in the snow. Suitcases, children, those images that –

RRTeam:[00:04:28] Yeah.

June: [00:04:29] ... we probably have all seen. And so Plattsburgh Cares was getting organized in April of that spring.

RRTeam:[00:04:37] Wow.

June: [00:04:41] 2017.

RRTeam:[00:04:41] Yeah. And did you know where people were coming from? Which states people were coming up from, or...?

June: [00:04:48] I knew nothing. I knew nothing. I didn't even really know where Roxham road was in the town of Champlain.

RRTeam:[00:04:55] Wow.

June: [00:04:55] I mean I'd passed it many times, but it's a dead-end road, there would be no reason I would've ever driven [00:05:00] down it.

RRTeam:[00:05:00] Right, right.

June: [00:05:01] So, I didn't even know where it was.

RRTeam:[00:05:03] So, April of 2017, that's when the group formed.

June: [00:05:06] That's when the group started to get organized, right.

RRTeam:[00:05:07] Started to get organized.

June: [00:05:08] Mm-hmm [affirmative].

RRTeam:[00:05:09] Okay. What does that mean by started to get organized, and how many people did you start with?

June: [00:05:15] We started with about six of an executive committee. We got some of the groundwork set up and then we went public and we started looking for volunteers to help us if we needed larger numbers of people to do whatever. You know, collect food or to find housing. We connected with the churches. And we have I think probably at least 200 volunteers.

RRTeam:[00:05:43] Wow.

June: [00:05:44] Right.

RRTeam:[00:05:45] What was one of the first things that you felt Plattsburgh Cares needed to do? April 2017 the organizing committee started. What was one of the first needs that you thought, or the first direct support things that you thought you needed?

June: [00:05:58] Housing.

RRTeam:[00:05:59] Housing.

June: [00:06:00] [00:06:00] Housing. We knew we needed some kind of temporary housing should someone arrive and we had to put them some place safe. We had heard stories of people arriving by bus and not really knowing what to do and not having any money, and just sitting out on the street. Plattsburgh doesn't have a huge homeless population. There's some but not many. We don't have any shelters. It's a small community, so housing really I think was one of the things that we worked on quickly. That and legal care, because we were also very concerned that we not give any legal advice to anybody. That's not our role and also we certainly didn't know much.

RRTeam:[00:06:46] Right. Okay. And in Plattsburgh, when you say that you had heard, who were you hearing these things from?

June: [00:06:54] It actually was people who... It was very random stories. People would say, [00:07:00] "I saw this guy at the bus station for two days." And it's not even a bus station. It's a mini mart.

RRTeam:[00:07:06] Oh.

June: [00:07:06] And it's where the bus just pulls in and leaves again. It's still cold here into the spring, so people were concerned.

RRTeam:[00:07:14] Yeah. Yeah. Could you share with us what those first few months were like when you were organizing and trying to figure things out, the lay of the land, and what type of activities you needed to do? And then, seeing people come in. Could you share with us the first few months.

June: [00:07:33] The first few months, in my view was a little frustrating because I like to be very organized, but it's hard to organize something that you don't understand and you can't foresee. We were working with ideas that we didn't know would even be needed, and we were setting up a framework for something that we weren't even sure what it was. We did get a lot of ducks in a row in terms [00:08:00] of a place to house someone through a church, and we knew that we could get some food, and we had a couple of lawyers who could help a little bit.

But what really happened that made it work better for us is that a family arrived. A family arrived from Syria a couple months later, and all of a sudden we're like, "Oh, this is what we have to do." Here we have people, and they don't have a place to stay, and they don't have any food, and they've got a car, and they need to do something, and what are they going to do? And who is their lawyer? When you're presented with actual people, the needs become much clearer.

RRTeam:[00:08:47] Mm-hmm [affirmative]. Do you think that that was in your recollection that that was the first family that came?

June: [00:08:53] Oh, no, I'm sure it was not.

RRTeam:[00:08:55] Okay.

June: [00:08:55] I'm sure it was not. It was the first one that ended up in Plattsburgh that [00:09:00] definitely needed some help.

RRTeam:[00:09:03] Right.

June: [00:09:04] Yeah.

RRTeam:[00:09:04] Okay. And then, what was it like when more and more people started to come in? Can you describe that?

June: [00:09:09] Well, what we found out, and what's really changed our whole focus is that most of the people who are coming through this area are not stopping in Plattsburgh, other than to climb in a cab. They know what to do. Almost everyone now has learned what to do. Whether they learn it from a YouTube video, or articles, or this underground network that seems to exist that I'm sure does exist, they know what they're doing. They get transportation to Plattsburgh, they know to call a taxi, and many times they have the numbers, and they go directly to Roxham, or some of them go to the actual crossing depending on their situation. And they don't end up in Plattsburgh, so we have not needed to use-

RRTeam:[00:09:59] Oh.

June: [00:10:00] ... [00:10:00] very much of the framework that we set up two years ago.

RRTeam:[00:10:04] Right. Okay. When was it that you started to pivot the initial framework that you thought you needed.

June: [00:10:13] There's not really an answer to that because I think, and if you talk to some other Plattsburgh Cares people on the executive committee, you'll see that what we really have done is we've sort of split our focus. We have the Roxham focus that I handle, primarily because I live here, and then we have the one where some people do end up in Plattsburgh not because they're trying to go to Canada necessarily, just because they happen to get to Plattsburgh and be an immigrant, perhaps undocumented, and want help, and even want to stay in Plattsburgh.

RRTeam:[00:10:52] Oh.

June: [00:10:54] We are helping some people who intend to stay in Plattsburgh but need services.

RRTeam:[00:10:58] Okay.

June: [00:10:59] All [00:11:00] right? And we've also worked with the international student community at the college.

RRTeam:[00:11:05] Wow. That's-

June: [00:11:05] So it's become much broader than just a pipeline going into Canada.

RRTeam:[00:11:12] Right. Wow.

June: [00:11:14] Yeah, it's pretty awesome when you think about it. It's much bigger than we envisioned.

RRTeam:[00:11:19] Yeah.

June: [00:11:19] We thought we were helping people who were fleeing, but as it turned out, it's not just that.

RRTeam:[00:11:26] Mm-hmm [affirmative]. And you've developed a resource that the area clearly-

June: [00:11:30] Yes.

RRTeam:[00:11:31] ... needed.

June: [00:11:31] Yes.

RRTeam:[00:11:31] When you started the work with PC, and even the Roxham road end-

June: [00:11:37] Mm-hmm [affirmative].

RRTeam:[00:11:39] ... how did you position this and how did you talk about this in the community, with your friends, with your neighbours?

June: [00:11:48] That's a very interesting... It's a very interesting position that I've had to take, and what it is is, it's like [00:12:00] the elephant in the room. Everyone knows what I do and no one talks about it, and I think it's because, first of all, I'm a known quantity, and I have, I think, a pretty good relationship with people because they know how much I care about everyone in the community. If they don't agree with me philosophically about refugees, or immigrants, or whatever, asylum seekers. Whatever you want to call the big group. They don't bring it up because it's in conflict of what they see in me. I don't know if that makes sense or not.

RRTeam:[00:12:40] Mm-hmm [affirmative].

Mm-hmm [affirmative].

June: [00:12:41] What it's become is that in my mind it's strictly humanitarian. If I know that people are arriving on Roxham and they don't have coats and I hand them coats, that's the same gesture that I would make to the family around the street who maybe doesn't [00:13:00] have coats. It's not important to me whether they grew up in Champlain, New York, if they grew up in Nigeria, or if they grew up in Florida. It's all humanitarian. And the gestures that I do there on Roxham are very similar to ones that I do right here in Champlain, and that's kind of the way I see the world. And people here don't understand why I would do that for people who are bad in their minds, because they've done something illegal, but they don't want to discuss it because they can't quite figure out why someone like me who is so willing to help them would do something to help someone who maybe is not doing something the right way. Is that-

RRTeam:[00:13:54] Yeah.

June: [00:13:54] ... is that clear?

RRTeam:[00:13:55] Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

June: [00:13:57] I think that's the way it's seen. Most [00:14:00] people don't ask me about it, but they know about it, and they just accept that that's just what she does.

RRTeam:[00:14:08] Mm-hmm [affirmative]. For you, in your mind, this is a humanitarian gesture.

June: [00:14:13] Mm-hmm [affirmative].

RRTeam:[00:14:14] Have you looked at the policies and thought about the legal things behind what has brought people to Roxham road? How did the research and the understanding, your own education of the legal complexities of that road, how did that go into your understanding of what you were doing? The humanitarian work that you were doing.

June: [00:14:40] First of all, I've had to learn a lot. I've learned a lot about immigration here in the US, and I've learned a lot about crossing an international border, and I've learned a lot about human rights, and I've learned a lot about countries around the world who [00:15:00] are having all kinds of problems from effects of climate change, to war, to genocide, to whatever. I've learned a lot. In terms of sharing that with local people, many of them I don't think are very interested, and I don't spend a lot of time trying to educate them on that because they're not there.

But, what I always try to explain is that people do have the right to ask for asylum, and this is not illegal, it is irregular. And I do try to stress that. And then secondly, criminals are not arriving on Roxham road for the most part and walking in the arms of the police. That is not a way that a criminal would try to get into Canada, or a criminal would try to get into the US. You don't walk into the arms of police officers at a setting where they're going to take you, and that it is a relatively safe [00:16:00] situation. Because people think that their taxi drivers are driving criminals down our country roads, and something bad's going to happen, and it's just not the situation.

RRTeam:[00:16:14] Right.

June: [00:16:14] What I've learned as a teacher is there's really a time and a place to try to educate people, and sometimes simple is best.

RRTeam:[00:16:21] Yeah.

Mm-hmm [affirmative].

June: [00:16:21] And, I would like them to know more about why so many people from the Congo are leaving, or why almost everyday now I see people from Colombia, and some of the stories that I hear, but people aren't really interested in those details. They want to know how it affects them personally. No one's going to come and hurt you, and these people need a safe place to live.

RRTeam:[00:16:45] Right.

Mm-hmm [affirmative].

June: [00:16:46] And I keep it very simple.

RRTeam:[00:16:47] Yeah. And how did you learn about the... Or do you think about the Canada, US Safe Third Country Agreement?

June: [00:16:56] Yeah, I only know the basics of that. And [00:17:00] I do understand why it was set up, and... I just have talked to so many people who no longer feel safe in the US. And, from my white perspective, first of all, it breaks my heart, and then secondly, I live such a privileged life, and I can't imagine not feeling safe in this country, but I've heard thousands of stories now, so I'm sure they are true.

RRTeam:[00:17:29] Right.

One is actually just picking up on this to hear more about the trends you've been seeing, and just in terms of the work you're actually doing on Roxham road. What does that look like? Because we haven't been there on the grounds, so maybe just more of what it is you actually do, and then what you are seeing. But then the second question is also how you got connected with the Bridges Not Borders, and then how you have negotiated that into your work.

June: [00:18:00] [00:18:00] Mm-hmm [affirmative]. Okay, so the first one. Yeah, I'm just going into my third year, so for two solid years I've been going six days a week from...

RRTeam:[00:18:11] So for two solid years you've been doing it six days a week?

June: [00:18:14] Six days a week, so everyday except for Sunday, unless I'm travelling. Usually I go for about two hours a day. So I usually go from 2:30 to 4:30 or 5:00. And that's because there's a bus that arrives in Plattsburgh around 2:00 or 2:15. And the Amtrak train comes into Plattsburgh around 3:00, and it's a half an hour trip. But, means of transportation has changed also, because people are afraid to board Greyhound buses because ICE has been boarding the bus. It's a little hit or miss. There are a lot more private drivers, a [00:19:00] few Ubers, some random people that I don't know how they got into it. I've got stories.

RRTeam:[00:19:07] Wow.

June: [00:19:07] I won't go into all those. We'd be here for like ten hours. That's what I've been doing. In the summer I hand out treats, little bags of chips, which a couple of the RCMP officers have screamed at me for that because they make a mess in the building. And toys for the kids. You saw some of them in the back of the car.

RRTeam:[00:19:34] Yeah.

June: [00:19:35] And then in the winter, I'm really well stocked with hats, scarves, gloves, and jackets. And those donations come from around the country.

RRTeam:[00:19:46] Okay.

June: [00:19:47] They just get mailed to me. There are no secrets. I don't know how they got my address, but it must have been online. They show up with nice letters. A lady just sent me four scarves last week.

RRTeam:[00:19:57] Wow. That's [00:20:00] amazing.

And the toys and the treats as well?

June: [00:20:02] Yeah. There was a church down in Keen, which is about two hours south of here that brought up three bags of stuffed animals. And people mail money, just trusting I just cash the cheque. They make them out to me, I cash them, I have an envelope. Whenever I need supplies I just go to the store and I just buy them.

RRTeam:[00:20:20] Wow, amazing.

June: [00:20:22] There's a group in Brooklyn called the Brooklyn Ethical Centre. They send money every three or four months, a little bit of money. Sometimes it's $10, sometimes it's $100, and I just tell them what I'm spending it on and...

RRTeam:[00:20:41] Wow. Yeah.

June: [00:20:42] I've called people in Hawaii, I've called people in Colorado. They just reach out. There was a PBS news hour, I don't know if you saw. There was a PBS weekend news hour show that aired about a year and a half ago. It's [00:21:00] very well done. They interviewed me, they interviewed some people in Montreal. They interviewed I think a couple of people who had crossed. That seemed to be the thing that got the connections from around the country.

RRTeam:[00:21:17] Okay. And when you say you drop off... Are you dropping the toys and everything off at the building? Is there a building?

June: [00:21:27] No, I hand it to the people.

RRTeam:[00:21:29] Yeah, okay.

June: [00:21:29] Before they cross I'm right there. On my side, on the American side there's nothing there but a parking area. What I do is I basically I wait for people to arrive. And some days in that two hour period there are 25, and some days there are none. Usually there's somebody. I couldn't go yesterday because of the Village Fest, but I went on Friday and no one showed up. Very unusual. But on [00:22:00] Wednesday. Wednesday there were over 20.

RRTeam:[00:22:04] Do you interact with the RCMP officers?

June: [00:22:06] I do a little bit. I try not to because I... Not because I don't like them. Pretty much they're really, really nice people. Very professional. They all know me. I pull in, they open the door, and they look at me and then they wave, we wave. Some of them are chatty. They come out and stand there until I get out and go talk to them. Some of them hate me. They think that I'm setting up people to cross, like I've invited them to come from Nigeria to Champlain to cross. Obviously I have no contact with anyone beforehand. Most of them are professional and I appreciate them.

Some of them have been really horrible, shouting things at me, "I'm going to have you arrested by border patrol." I just walk away. [00:23:00] The guy that yells at me about the chips, every time he's like, "I told you not to give them chips!" He said, "Who's going to clean those up? Who's going to clean them up in my building?" Last time I said, "Well, I'd be happy to come over and clean them up. I don't think you're going to let me come." He just walked away, he was just mad.

RRTeam:[00:23:18] And what about border patrol? Are they-

June: [00:23:22] Border patrol doesn't do anything. Once in awhile they drive down there just to look at the cameras, but a lot of border patrol are my former students, too.

RRTeam:[00:23:34] Wow.

June: [00:23:34] They don't have any trouble with it. Some of them really hate these kinds of people. They're all people of colour, right? So, we're really talking about racism here , but it's not overt, but it's... I think it's an underlying issue, but anyway. The border patrol, most of them are men, the border patrol people [00:24:00] have been very, very good. They know I'm there. I'm on camera everyday. When they do come down they're very polite. They're doing their jobs. I don't get any trouble from our local border patrol. I'm very supportive of them. They help me here in the village, too, as far as that goes. Their presence is not a bad thing. Yeah, yeah, I don't have any trouble with them at all. Most of them are very, very nice. Even when they don't like the situation, they appreciate that someone's getting a hat. That's what I found.

RRTeam:[00:24:35] Is border patrol one of the major employers in this area?

June: [00:24:40] Well, yeah, it would be one of the major employers, although most of the border patrol agents don't live in the community, they probably live closer to Plattsburgh-

RRTeam:[00:24:49] Yeah.

June: [00:24:49] ... where there are more services. But, yeah, definitely the border with all of the offices between customs, immigration, border patrol, GSA, all the government [00:25:00] employees that work up there, it's a huge employer. A lot of my friends work there.

RRTeam:[00:25:04] Yeah. Mm-hmm [affirmative].

June: [00:25:07] Yeah. Yeah. They're good jobs, they do a good job. I have nothing but positive things to say about them. I don't look at them as the enemy at all, nor do I the RCMP.

RRTeam:[00:25:21] Right.

June: [00:25:23] They're very good. They're very good. They've tightened up. It was a little loose at the beginning. They didn't all give the same message. It was a little confusing, it was not always truthful. Some of them would say, "You're going to be deported tomorrow," but now it's very clear. "This is what you're doing, these are the consequences. You have the right to a lawyer," and so on. "We're police, we're not immigration." It's a clear message now, for the most part. Now, let's see, what was your-

RRTeam:[00:25:53] Yeah, so the second one was [00:26:00] around Bridges Not Borders and just how you developed that. How did that come about and-

June: [00:26:15] Yeah, I'm trying to remember. Did they talk about how we made the original connection? It was Wendy, I think contacted me somehow, but I'm not sure if she did it through Plattsburgh Cares, or if she contacted me directly. I honestly do not remember how, or maybe I didn't know how she originally got to me. She might've sent a message through Plattsburgh Cares, and then I probably answered it and said, "I live in Champlain." And then we met several times. We did several interviews together, several TV interviews together. Either Wendy or Grace, right?

RRTeam:[00:26:54] Yes.

June: [00:26:55] Yeah. They came down to my house several [00:27:00] times, we went to Roxham together, and then finally decided that you don't want a lot of people on Roxham road. It's intimidating, it's frightening, it's not a good scene for the asylum seekers, so we decided that it would be best if they could just take a day and do similar things to what I do. Sundays seem like a good day for them, and it was fine for me to have one day when I didn't have to put that in my schedule.

RRTeam:[00:27:29] So then you're the only one from Plattsburgh Cares who does this work?

June: [00:27:32] Mm-hmm [affirmative]. I am, but I have people up here who, and from various places, who come on some days. On Monday, I have a friend, and on Tuesday I have a friend, and Wednesday. I do have people who come and join me, and then if they can't come I'm by myself. Fridays and Saturdays sometimes I'm by myself. It doesn't really matter to me, [00:28:00] but it's nice to have someone else there. And people want to be involved. They want to feel like they're making a difference in this tough world right now. It's something you can do... Action is so much better than words. It's so much more gratifying to feel like you can really make a tiny bit of difference, and rather than just talk about it.

RRTeam:[00:28:23] I was going to ask a question sort of connected to that, sort of how you think about it, or how you describe that part of the work, and then also maybe linking it back to what you mean when you say, "It's just humanitarian." And if those are connected, maybe you could just talk a little bit more about that. So sort of how you describe what's the work that you're doing through Plattsburgh Cares.

June: [00:28:48] One thing that's kind of funny is that we always use the word "work." And I use that word work too, but it's not work. It's not work. It's [00:29:00] bearing witness. It's being there, it's really a gift. It's a gift when you're able to somehow, thanks really to geography, happen to fall into a situation where you realize that you can make this tiny bit of difference in someone's life for about a minute. And, it's going to stay with you forever, and it might stay with them forever, particularly the children.

When you hand that stuffed animal to a child. There was a little girl last week, and she picked out a llama out of the bag, and for a stuffed animal, it had kind of longer hair so she was just petting it and stroking. Hugging it and petting it and stroking. Looked up at me and she said, "Thank you. Thank you." Those little things will stay with me forever, and I think if she keeps [00:30:00] that llama she'll remember that when she's 60 years old and remember that lady that gave her that llama.

But it's just the connection, it's not me. It's really not about me, and the same thing with my friends who come. It's just a human to human connection, and I feel like we have it regardless of where we were born. And it just doesn't matter how we're different, because almost entirely we are alike.

RRTeam:[00:30:19] Mm-hmm [affirmative].

June: [00:30:19] And that's why I call it humanitarian, because I just see it as human to human. Our stories are vastly different, but inside we're pretty much all the same.

I don't know. There's no other way to explain it, and it's either like you get it or you don't. But I do find that when I take people with me, and I make them stand back because I want them to be the witness, I don't want them to be feeling they have to do anything, because then you get the feeling, [00:31:00] "Am I doing it right?" And you worry about yourself. You need to remove yourself in the background and watch. And I have taken no one who doesn't start crying and saying, "I just didn't understand." Regardless of how they feel about immigrants. It's because you see someone and you think, "That could be me. That could be me with my little girl, or my little boy, or my husband, or all by myself." And that's where you see that you get those feelings of, "Wow, that's another human doing something that I don't even know if I could do that."

RRTeam:[00:31:41] Yeah.

June: [00:31:41] And that's it. That's what it is. And I don't have any other way to explain it, but once they see it they get it.

RRTeam:[00:31:53] Is that part of what keeps you going back?

June: [00:31:57] I just can't bear the [00:32:00] idea of someone being so scared to take those final steps without someone just saying, "I see you and you count." And sometimes I say, "I see you and I'm going to keep you safe until you cross." And they just... they'll collapse. They'll just grab me and just hug me and just start crying. The fear must be tremendous.

RRTeam:[00:32:24] Mm-hmm [affirmative].

Mm-hmm [affirmative].

June: [00:32:25] I don't know if any of the three of you have ever been in a situation like that. I've never been that scared. I've been nervous about a lot of things.

RRTeam:[00:32:33] Yeah.

Yeah.

June: [00:32:34] But I've never been that afraid for what my future held. I don't know if I can add anything or not. It's very hard to describe because, as I said, a lot of it, it just has to do with this, it's kind of an intuitive, I don't know.

RRTeam:[00:32:52] Yeah.

June: [00:32:53] I don't know.

RRTeam:[00:32:56] Can you speak a little bit more about the trends? You mentioned that on [00:33:00] Friday there was nobody, but other days there's 20. Has there been more of an increase?

June: [00:33:07] Well, I know that the statistics show that it dropped by about half-

RRTeam:[00:33:14] Yeah.

June: [00:33:15] ... last spring or so. I think that's what I read. To me, it seems like there's been an increase the past month, but I don't know if that's true because keep in mind, they're coming 24/7.

RRTeam:[00:33:28] Yeah.

June: [00:33:28] ... and I'm only there two or three hours. And I know that a fair number want to come at night because they think they're safer under the cloak of darkness, and I'm not going to go to Roxham at three in the morning. It's not a good use of my time, it's faster. I wouldn't want to stop them when it's so dark to say something to them. It's not... I don't know. I don't want to be there in the middle of the night. So I don't know what the overall numbers are.

RRTeam:[00:33:56] Right.

June: [00:33:57] But, I'd say the past three weeks for [00:34:00] me has been busier than it was in, say, I don't know, March, April, and May.

RRTeam:[00:34:09] And at the height of the movement of people going, what was that like? What was that time like for you?

June: [00:34:17] It was intense. It was intense because you had large, large groups. You could have five cabs pull in with six people per taxi, and have 30 people with luggage, with children, and the kids are running all over the place. And it was in the winter, and they'd be so needy in terms of needing clothing and you couldn't find the right jacket at that moment to help that particular person and... Yeah, it was pretty frantic.

And they weren't as well informed. And they've moved the path now, the path is much better. Once they moved the path, it became a little bit [00:35:00] easier because it's more level. You used to go over these rocks and through this ditch and the bags would fall and the...

RRTeam:[00:35:07] Yeah, it's like one of those images.

June: [00:35:09] Oh, it was just awful, and you can try to help them but depending on your RCMP officer, some of them were like, "Okay, we don't care if you help them," and then some would be like, "Don't you dare cross. Don’t you do anything to encourage them." And they'd be screaming at me and it was tough. That first year was really hard.

RRTeam:[00:35:31] Yeah. So that would've been the winter of 2017.

June: [00:35:33] Yeah. Mm-hmm [affirmative].

RRTeam:[00:35:35] Mm-hmm [affirmative].

June: [00:35:37] Yep.

RRTeam:[00:35:37] And in terms of the trends, where people were coming from...

June: [00:35:42] Well you had that August of 2017 where you had over 5,000 Haitians, but then that winter it was primarily Nigerians I think. Let me add, though, that I believe strongly that I don't need to [00:36:00] know where they come from.

RRTeam:[00:36:01] Right.

June: [00:36:01] So I don't ask.

RRTeam:[00:36:02] Right. Yeah.

June: [00:36:04] So I don't really have a lot of information unless they tell me. And you never ask them. But, recently, for the past probably four or five months, a lot of Spanish speaking people, and my Spanish is not good. I can barely get anything across to them, and they're not as well informed unfortunately. Can I tell you one quick story to…

RRTeam:[00:36:29] Yeah.

Yeah.

June: [00:36:29] But, last week, a family of three arrived; mom, dad, and a boy, probably about 11 or so, and a dog. That little dog in a carrier. I'd never seen a dog arrive before. So I'm just looking, thinking, "What are the rules about pets?" And they speak Spanish and no English except the boy spoke a little bit of English. And I usually use the children as the translators, also, especially the ones that are born in United States. And [00:37:00] so they got the message from the police, Canadian. Well, they talked to them. They often don't speak Spanish. They'll say, "Do you speak English? Do you speak French?" And the people just stare at them.

RRTeam:[00:37:14] Yeah, really.

June: [00:37:15] That's not a good thing either. And, of course, they always tell them to go to the regular crossing. That's part of the standard speech. These three just stood there, and I was talking to the driver, who that's another story I don't know...

He's from Mooers which is the neighbouring community, had no Uber sticker, had no Lyft sticker. Don't have any idea where he found these people. I'm a little suspicious that he's maybe, I don't know, thinking maybe they came through the southern border and he's some kind of driver of some sort. He didn't know what he was doing. He'd never been down there before.

And they got [00:38:00] all the luggage, everything was ready, and they decided not to cross. So they drag everything back to this guy, and I'm thinking, "This is not good," and I said, tried to in Spanish, "Do you have family in Canada?" Thinking maybe they legally can do it. And they said, "No." So I was like, to myself, "This is not good."

So they climb back in this guy's car, and I said to the driver, "Where are you going to take them?" He said, "I don't know." I said, "Well, if they want to go to the regular crossing," I said, "All you can do is take them to duty free up here." I said, "You can't take them to the crossing, it's not allowed. You can't drive them and say, "Hop out here." That's not allowed. You're going to be in big trouble." And his eyes are getting big, and I said, "You'll have to take them to duty free, and you're going to have to tell them to walk the rest of the way." It's a quarter mile. [00:39:00] And he said, "Okay." Oh my god. This big north country guy, I'm like, "Oh, he doesn't have a clue." And so, off they drove, and I was really worried. There's nothing I can do. I was so worried.

This is not the end of the story. Then about half an hour later, a friend who was in Plattsburgh at the bus station texts me and she said, "A woman is coming who's from..." I don't know where. I don't remember where. "But the driver also is going to go by duty free to pick up someone." And I said, "Oh, is it a family?" And she said, "I don't know." And I said, "I bet it's a family with a dog." Sure enough, 40 minutes later, that taxi pulls in with this woman from wherever, and the same family, dad jumps out. He says, "Hola!" I'm like, "Hola!" Thinking what is going on here? And they all just [00:40:00] cross, they all just crossed.

RRTeam:[00:40:02] Was the woman with them a Spanish speaker as well?

June: [00:40:04] Mm-mm.

RRTeam:[00:40:05] Oh.

June: [00:40:05] Mm-mm.

RRTeam:[00:40:06] Wow, I wonder how that.

June: [00:40:08] I can't figure it out. I have no idea. Maybe he made a phone call, maybe he got mixed up. Maybe dad called someone and said, "What are we supposed to do." I don't know.

RRTeam:[00:40:21] Wow. Could you talk a little bit more about your relationship with the taxi drivers? Well, not the relationship, but who's texting you, and…

June: [00:40:29] Yeah, no the relationship would be another five hour conversation, too. I have a couple of drivers who will text me, particularly in the winter if they've got people who are very needy in terms of clothing. And one of them I trust a lot, and so he actually stops by my house at other times of the day and night, and will just stop by and then I've got the stuff right there. But, [00:41:00] also there are a couple people who are doing studies of, I'm assuming Plattsburgh?

RRTeam:[00:41:05] Yep.

June: [00:41:05] And so, they just sometimes go to the bus station so they can either talk to people and see what's going on, and they'll text me if people are coming, or say, "No one got off the bus," which is kind of helpful. But in general, I have no idea who's coming.

RRTeam:[00:41:24] Okay. And somehow they're just getting your number, probably word of mouth or do you know how they're getting your number?

June: [00:41:31] Well, when people ask questions through Plattsburgh Cares, I get those email messages as well as the president. If it deals with a specific thing about Roxham that I feel I can answer, I will answer it, but generally I say, "Refer to our flyer."

RRTeam:[00:41:52] Right.

June: [00:41:53] Yeah. And once in a while, depending on if it's someone who has [00:42:00] already crossed who's said, "My brother's coming." And I'm still in touch with that person. I let them share my number, but I'm pretty careful with it.

And then, as far as the taxi drivers go, it's a whole... It's quite a group, but I do have a good rapport with all of them for the most part.

RRTeam:[00:42:23] Do you know where they're coming from? Where they live?

June: [00:42:25] Well, they all live in the Plattsburgh area, more or less, within probably 10 miles of Plattsburgh. The two drivers that I trust the most, one is... he immigrated from Somalia 40 years ago, the other one is a Canadian-US citizen, has dual citizenship, and his mother's from Haiti. He's the one that I really trust. But the others are all just... I don't know. [00:43:00] Don't want to say anything bad, but I just tell them they're doing an important job and thank you for keeping everyone safe.

RRTeam:[00:43:11] You mentioned the flyer-

June: [00:43:13] Mm-hmm [affirmative].

RRTeam:[00:43:14] So maybe we could talk a little bit about that, and in a context of the other work that Plattsburgh Cares does currently.

June: [00:43:22] Mm-hmm [affirmative]. Yeah. The flyer was put together probably within six months... Six to nine months of forming Plattsburgh Cares. It went on our website and we printed many copies, and we shared them locally in the hotels and other places, the bus station, other places that we thought people might be travelling through and might need the information. Have you looked at it?

RRTeam:[00:43:53] Mm-hmm [affirmative].

June: [00:43:54] Yeah. It's basically, in our mind, it was a ‘things you need to know and how to stay safe.’ And we were [00:44:00] really motivated by the taxi drivers that were price gouging, or maybe weren't even legit drivers that might mislead them and take them to some place unsafe... or traffickers, or whatever. Might as well not be naïve about things. And that was the goal of that, to just give people good information that they needed to know. Of course, I'm sure you know that it kind of blew up in our faces because someone found it in a hotel in Plattsburgh and claimed that it was inviting people to cross illegally into Canada, which of course was not our intention whatsoever. I don't think we have those fires out right now, but it is still electronically is available, and it does give really good information.

Then as far as... You talked about other things in [00:45:00] Plattsburgh. I can't really answer that. I'm not really sure if that flyer has been beneficial to people who maybe have ended up deciding to stay in Plattsburgh. I don't really know. I think what happens in that case is they often end up either at social services, maybe... probably not the police... the hospital. And they need help and English is not their first language, so the hospital or DSS reaches out to us and says, "Can you help us?" We have a pretty good list of people from the college that speak different languages.

RRTeam:[00:45:41] At SUNY Plattsburgh?

June: [00:45:43] At SUNY Plattsburgh.

RRTeam:[00:45:43] And can be translators.

June: [00:45:44] Yeah. Mm-hmm [affirmative]. Yeah.

RRTeam:[00:45:49] It sounds like you may be the most active member of Plattsburgh Cares, and let us know if that's not true, so what kind of work are the other members of the group [00:46:00] currently doing?

June: [00:46:02] There are a couple of families in Plattsburgh right now that they're working with. One just had a baby a couple of days ago, so there are four children there now. The husband is employed, but they need help with babysitting, so some Plattsburgh Care volunteers actually serve as drivers, they serve as babysitters, they take them grocery shopping. They do a lot of hands on things, day to day life for this family, and I think there's another woman also with two children. They've helped them find housing, helped find legal assistance in terms of their visas, their paperwork, that kind of day to day stuff that if you're new and don't speak the language well, it's essential.

RRTeam:[00:46:53] Yeah.

June: [00:46:53] Yeah, yeah.

RRTeam:[00:46:53] Mostly settlement work.

June: [00:46:54] Yeah. Exactly. Yeah, that's a good word.

RRTeam:[00:46:55] And you also mentioned that the group is doing some work [00:47:00] with international students-

June: [00:47:06] Yes.

RRTeam:[00:47:06] ... at the college.

June: [00:47:07] Yes, they also worked with international students. Yeah.

RRTeam:[00:47:11] Is it mostly around immigration status issues or-

June: [00:47:16] I think I has to do more with welcoming issues. I know that some of the students had said that they didn't feel very welcome in Plattsburgh. They'd go to Walmart and have some people shout things at them. The communities here are not very diverse, so anyone who looks different just stands out and people are a little emboldened right now to say something. It's providing support for that, if they're going up to Walmart or one of the grocery stores, and even having someone go with them. [00:48:00] It's those kinds of things. It seems small but it's really big.

RRTeam:[00:48:02] It is.

June: [00:48:02] Yeah.

RRTeam:[00:48:09] And you mentioned earlier you may not... in terms of thinking about your relationship with Bridges Not Borders that you see things a little differently.

June: [00:48:18] Mm-hmm [affirmative].

RRTeam:[00:48:18] That's how you phrased it. Maybe if you're willing, would you…

June: [00:48:21] Oh, yeah, and it's not. Yeah, absolutely.

RRTeam:[00:48:24] Yeah. Yeah.

June: [00:48:24] It's not a negative thing. That border just makes the viewpoint, it's going to be different. One thing that they did, I don't know if they're still doing it, but when they come to Roxham on Sundays, they actually gather statistics, or they used to. They used to jot down where people were coming from, and whatever information they could gather at that brief encounter. They also hand out items. They're very caring. Absolutely. But, they just gather more information, and I don't gather any information. The only information [00:49:00] I gather is what people tell me, which sometimes is a lot, and many times is nothing. Their group meets... I don't know if it's monthly. Did they tell you?

RRTeam:[00:49:14] I don't know if they did, actually.

Yeah.

June: [00:49:15] They meet fairly frequently because I get the summary of their meetings, and I get the announcements of their meetings. I did attend one, was really interesting. A lot of wonderful people. But they've got a lot more of an agenda in terms of the Safe Third Country Agreement, and how to spread information, and have potlucks for immigrants. All kinds of activities. They're more active. I think we're a little more reactive in terms of, "Oh, someone's here, we have to do something."

Well, people are crossing into Canada. They want to stay, so you've got a population. Not right in [00:50:00] Hemmingford but some of their members... I'm quite sure that a lot of them work in Montreal.

RRTeam:[00:50:05] Mm-hmm [affirmative].

Yeah.

Yeah.

June: [00:50:05] [Yeah, so they have a population they have access to. We have a population that we welcome and send on, so it's different.

RRTeam:[00:50:18] Yeah.

June: [00:50:18] It's just that the two situations are totally different. And they're just a little more... I don't know. I guess a little more active. Yeah.

RRTeam:[00:50:30] Or active in a different way.

June: [00:50:33] Yeah. Yeah.

RRTeam:[00:50:35] Because going everyday to the border sounds pretty active.

Yeah.

Yeah.

June: [00:50:38] Well, okay, that's true.

RRTeam:[00:50:40] Sounds pretty busy.

June: [00:50:43] Yeah.

RRTeam:[00:50:44] Yeah.

June: [00:50:49] True.

RRTeam:[00:50:52] How do you navigate that around your own work?

June: [00:51:00] [00:51:00] I block out the time. I normally go to the office... First of all, this is a very small village. I don't even have to go there everyday. But, I'm learning the ropes. There's a lot going on. I'm probably creating more than I need to sometimes. It's a little bit of my personality, I think. But I normally go to the office from 9:00 to 1:00, so I spend four to five hours there a day. And then, from two o'clock on, I'm just not available. And if they need me then they can find me after that when I come back. I walk around every night, I talk to people every evening. I'm out, so if someone needs me between 2:00 and 5:00, they can re-schedule that.

RRTeam:[00:51:51] Yeah.

June: [00:51:52] Yeah.

RRTeam:[00:51:53] What's the population of this town?

June: [00:51:56] 1,100.

RRTeam:[00:51:56] Okay.

June: [00:51:57] Yeah.

RRTeam:[00:51:57] Yeah.

June: [00:51:57] In the village.

RRTeam:[00:51:58] Yeah.

June: [00:51:58] It's a little confusing [00:52:00] because the village of Champlain is within the town of Champlain.

RRTeam:[00:52:03] Oh.

Right.

June: [00:52:04] So a township is a governmental entity rather than what you would call a town. In my mind, when I moved here from Oregon, a town is like a small city.

RRTeam:[00:52:17] Yeah.

Yeah.

June: [00:52:17] We use the word town for a small city, but a town in New York state is a division of a county.

RRTeam:[00:52:27] Oh.

Oh.

June: [00:52:29] Roxham road is in the town of Champlain, and I'm in the village of Champlain, and our borders are very small.

RRTeam:[00:52:36] Right.

June: [00:52:39] It's a little confusing.

RRTeam:[00:52:40] Yeah.

June: [00:52:41] So I have no jurisdiction as an elected official in the town of Champlain, but I do in the village.

RRTeam:[00:52:50] Were there any other wrap-up questions, or... do you have anything that you want to say, knowing about the project and about your [00:53:00] work? Is there any last things that you want to say?That we haven't covered.

June: [00:53:07] I guess the only thing that I always stress is that I just feel like what you're doing and what so many other people are doing, including journalists and television reporters is that it's just an important event in history that needs to be covered. Without commentary, it's important that... I'm glad you're doing it because it needs to be covered, it's something that we should all be aware of, that people are on the move everywhere around the world, and I think in the US we thought we were isolated from that. We could look at Europe and go, "Oh boy, they've got problems."

Well, here we are. United States, Canada, and people need [00:54:00] a safe place to live. We need policies that work. We really do, particularly in this country. It's just not working right now. But, so thank you for what you're doing.

RRTeam:[00:54:14] Thank you.

Thank you.Thank you. Yeah. Yeah. My question was really related to the things that you shared with us at the beginning, about how your own histories... how you think of your own histories and how that might relate to how that brings you to your current work.

June: [00:54:35] And I'm not sure how it affects me and my view of the world. It probably has an impact, but I'm not sure what. But I think also the fact that, being a second language teacher, living in France for a year, living in South Dakota, and working with inner city kids from Detroit, and [00:55:00] Native Americans from the Pine Ridge Reservation. I think it's all of those plus probably my own family's background, have just made me very open to different cultures and people from different places. So, anyway. Yeah.

The [paternal] side of the family was living in northern Ireland, in probably the late 1700's, and they were one of the many who decided that they were going to head to America, and they got on some kind of ship, and got off course, and instead it went north and there was a shipwreck. The traditional story is that they were rescued by some sailors from Nova Scotia who were out fishing, and so they took them all to Nova Scotia, and that's why my grandfather was born there, so he was born in Nova Scotia. And that's a documented story that if you Google the [00:56:00] name that that's how they ended up there rather than in America. An interesting turn of events.

My grandmother on that same side of the family, her family came from Scotland. She was born in Ontario, and then they ended up meeting in Alberta. I believe the family's homesteaded, so whatever drew people, there must have been land grants I would assume. So the families lived in Alberta, and then when my grandparents got married, they were seeking, he was seeking work and they went to Oregon, where he was working in lumber mills. And that's where I'm from.

On the other side of the family, on my mother's side of the family, it's equally interesting is that her father's family, so this is the [last name], they left England in the 1600's and [00:57:00] settled in America. so very, very early settlers, and they were Quakers, and involved in the revolutionary war. Bad soldier because they're against war. And eventually just kept going across the country, across the United States looking for work, looking for better living situation, and ended up in Oregon, as far as they could go. But it's typical; people looking for a good place to raise a family and be able to live safely and as healthy as you could with education. And that's the story. Of course, the interesting thing is that I made the circle back, because here I am on the east coast without really knowing much of any of this, and not very far from where my ancestors were.

RRTeam:[00:57:49] Right. Yeah, exactly.

June: [00:57:51] We're all on the move. We're all on the move.

RRTeam:[00:57:55] Sorry, did you say earlier why you ended up coming to this coast?

June: [00:57:58] Life [00:58:00] stories. One of those things where things happen to you and you end up some place else, and you have a choice of going back, which, can you ever really go back? I don't know. That would be another discussion. Or do you stay and you make it work? So I stayed and I made it work. And that's the story.

RRTeam:[00:58:23] That's great.

That's amazing. And you were teaching in South Dakota?

June: [00:58:29] I taught in Oregon, I taught in South Dakota, because he kept getting jobs, and then I taught at SUNY Plattsburgh, but I wanted to be back in high school, teaching. Teenagers are my love. I know I'm crazy.

RRTeam:[00:58:44] It's a talent.

June: [00:58:46] Yeah, I dearly like them. So, when this job came open I applied for it and then my second husband, and my current husband, we moved to Champlain at that [00:59:00] point, and then raised the kids here.

RRTeam:[00:59:02] Yeah, okay. Okay.

June: [00:59:04] Yeah.

RRTeam:[00:59:04] Yeah. Great.

June: [00:59:06] Yeah, and I'm sure you three have similar stories of just movement.

RRTeam:[00:59:10] Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

June: [00:59:12] It's human nature.

RRTeam:[00:59:14] Yeah.

June: [00:59:15] Yeah.

RRTeam:[00:59:16] Yeah.

June: [00:59:17] And they're all fascinating.

RRTeam:[00:59:19] They are.

June: [00:59:20] Yeah.

RRTeam:[00:59:20] Yeah, I think we all feel very lucky to be doing this work.

June: [00:59:26] Oh yeah, you must hear just incredible stories.

RRTeam:[00:59:30] Yeah, yeah.

June: [00:59:31] And I'm sure your own personal ones are just as interesting. That's humans. We all have-

RRTeam:[00:59:37] Yeah, that's true.